« The Heretech, episode 22: Alex Bender on inbound social media | Main | Not quite the use case he expected »

09/23/2009

Comments

Feed You can follow this conversation by subscribing to the comment feed for this post.

Tom, good to see you're getting it!

I've got a webinar coming up this week called "SaaS and the Death of Product Management,"; I'll be sure to make reference to the fact that you're learning about SaaS communities and their power!

rick chapman
www.saasuniversity.com
www.softletter.com

Rick, you have all the facts completely wrong.

Archer still has product managers. They do a lot more than just jot down interesting ideas from customers. (One example, among many: Guess who makes go/no-go decisions during each stage of the innovation process? Or figures out the boundaries of acceptable designs?)

Archer isn't even a 100% SaaS company. They still have an on-premise version of their product. More to the point, there's nothing about how they work with their community that depends on the SaaS model.

So, there's nothing here to "get," because they don't follow your strained, implausible theory of the relationship between SaaS and the product management function. So please, do not reference the Archer community, or my comments about Archer, or my podcast interview with the VP of Marketing at Archer, as any form of support for you or your ideas. In fact, I'd prefer that you not make reference to me at all.

+++ Rick, you have all the facts completely wrong. +++

I don't have it COMPLETELY wrong because after reading Softletter's material, you got some religion and began to investigate the concepts we first began writing about in 2008.

But that's OK. Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery! I am glad to show you the way!

+++ They do a lot more than just jot down interesting ideas from customers. +++

Well, no kidding! This Wednesday I'll be discussing what SaaS "product managers," assuming the title survives in SaaS, will be doing in the future. Plex will demonstrate what they replaced their product management system with, Quantum Whisper will provide a look at where I think community goes in a SaaS environment, I will discuss what comes after the current obsolete and increasingly irrelevant product management model employed by most software companies.

+++ Archer isn't even a 100% SaaS company. +++

They are primarily a client/server firm and you are certainly correct that this impacts their ability to use a community.

+++ More to the point, there's nothing about how they work with their community that depends on the SaaS model. +++

It's the other way around.

+++ So please, do not reference the Archer community, or my comments about Archer, or my podcast interview with the VP of Marketing at Archer, as any form of support for you or your ideas. In fact, I'd prefer that you not make reference to me at all. +++

I will be referencing you and Archer. Sorry about that. I will encourage people to listen to the Archer podcast and read the past posts on your site and Softletter's; I believe they are valuable, offering differing perspectives on important industry changes. I'll also be referencing another bit of Forrester data that I believe suppports an assertion I made in Chicago during our SaaS U session in which I discussed key metrics SaaS community managers will measured on in the future.

However, I will also point out the limitations in community leverage inherent in the C/S model.

But do attend the Wednesday session! I am quite sure you will listen to it, learn, and begin to investigate and write about the concepts and ideas we're introducing. As you have already done, and good for you!

rick chapman
www.saasuniversity.com
www.softletter.com

Rick, you're impossible to take seriously, for the following reasons:

(1) There is no evidence that you would treat as disproof of your hypothesis.

(2) You misrepresent our relationship (or, to be more accurate, lack thereof). I have not based any of my work on yours. In fact, I didn't even know SaaS University until June of this year. I've been doing research on product management since early 2008. My research on PM in a SaaS company was published in November 2008 (and started long before that).

(3) Your condescension crosses the line into the insulting. You are not my teacher. I am not your student.

(4) Your efforts at self-promotion might be darkly comic, if they weren't so desperate.

Tom, we already have 200 people slated to attend on Weds; I don't need to promote anything. I'm just having some fun!

I'm sure you'll be in attendance in some guise or another at the session on Weds. and I'm sure you'll learn some interesting things (or at least hear interesting opinions). (And I suspect we can look forward to you writing about some of the concepts discussed.)

Best of luck!

rick chapman
www.saasuniversity.com
www.softletter.com

I agree that SaaS might have a slight head start on steuricy in the cloud today, but ultimately any forward-facing Internet application architecture will have its own host of steuricy risks and mitigations. As you point out, this shouldn't be a reason to avoid it embrace it, learn the requisite skills, and take advantage of these new options. (And they are just that options. You have to determine what is the right strategy and mix for your business. All cloud? Some cloud? No cloud? SaaS? PaaS? There's no One Way to Do It. Just because you're running in the cloud , that doesn't allow you to abdicate from your responsibilities as a software architect or steuricy manager.

How could any of this be better satetd? It couldn't.

That insight would have saved us a lot of effrot early on.

The comments to this entry are closed.

About the Heretech

  • Tom Grant is a senior analyst at Forrester Research. You can e-mail him at tgrant@forrester.com, or reach him via Twitter at TomGrantForr. All opinions expressed here are my own, and not necessarily those of my employer, Forrester Research.

Heretech podcast

  • A weekly podcast about the technology industry, with a special emphasis on product management and product marketing. See the FEEDS section for the links to the podcast.

Twitter Updates

    follow me on Twitter